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Thread: The New Vesper Trail at Tysons

  1. #11
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    Steve O is offline I spend all day thinking about bikes and talking to people on the internet about them.
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    Quote Originally Posted by huskerdont View Post
    No curb cut at a trail intersection = brilliant.
    Actually, the curb cut would be right onto Route 7 and not at a light, so truthfully, taking the sidewalk there is the best option, IMO. The curb cut and crosswalk are slightly to the left if you look closely at the photo.
    In fact, a sign there at the end of the trail directing cyclists left or right (rather than straight onto 7) would serve both purposes: keeping riders from getting killed and deterring drivers from driving over the curb onto the trail.

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    Quote Originally Posted by huskerdont View Post
    I never said you were wrong, mind.

    No curb cut at a trail intersection = brilliant.
    Yep. Given where it looks like the trail intersects Rte. 7 - the lack of a curb cut makes total sense. I would expect most trail users would either stay on the sidewalk on Rte. 7 or mosey on over west the little bit to Spring Hill Rd. and ride there (or merge onto Rte. 7 there when the light favors them). I wonder if an obstruction (small fence/barrier) at the curb would've made more sense - to prevent cyclists/trail users from merging with Rte. 7 too quickly when exiting the trail?

    (So basically - what Steve said while I was typing a response.)
    Last edited by LhasaCM; 02-11-2019 at 11:02 AM. Reason: What Steve said

  4. #13
    Steve O's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mstone View Post
    And, there are treatments to block vehicle access that are safer than a bollard right in the middle of the path. But they're more effort than defaulting to dropping a bollard in.
    Agreed (e.g., new W&OD crossings near the Vienna Community Center). However, we don't even know if we need to block vehicles. Signs may be sufficient. After all, that's what is generally used to keep vehicles from going in places they don't belong (1-way streets, exits instead of entrances, etc.). Not 100% effective, but almost always good enough. Let's try signs first. And surface paint. If they work, then no need for any other treatment. Cheaper, safer.
    We don't put telephone poles (with painted yellow diamonds around them) in the middle of streets for good reason. Why is there this insistence on putting obstacles in the middle of trails?

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    Here's my vote for the next Tyson's project: Fix it so the nice bridge over the toll road doesn't end at a really poorly implemented trail around the hotel to Spring Hill road. This path is unusable as it is extremely narrow (5' total) lined with closely arranged bollards, a ghetto of trash, tree sized weeds, and obstacles from construction workers. Could they at least leave space at either end to allow exit and entrance from the path so we can ride the street instead of the gutter on this short section?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve O View Post
    Agreed (e.g., new W&OD crossings near the Vienna Community Center). However, we don't even know if we need to block vehicles. Signs may be sufficient. After all, that's what is generally used to keep vehicles from going in places they don't belong (1-way streets, exits instead of entrances, etc.). Not 100% effective, but almost always good enough. Let's try signs first. And surface paint. If they work, then no need for any other treatment. Cheaper, safer.
    We don't put telephone poles (with painted yellow diamonds around them) in the middle of streets for good reason. Why is there this insistence on putting obstacles in the middle of trails?
    Just for the record, I completely agree with this. I've known folks who have run into bollards. A person can avoid a bollard, but thousands of people can't.

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    A curb cut would be very useful for anyone trying to access the trail from the roadway, especially those riding across from the far side of Spring Hill Road. If motorist confusion is a problem, perhaps a design like this one could be implemented, instead of a bollard?

    (In fact, the historical StreetView shows that Patrick Henry used to have a bollard here. Perhaps there is hope for the future.)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve O View Post
    Agreed (e.g., new W&OD crossings near the Vienna Community Center). However, we don't even know if we need to block vehicles. Signs may be sufficient. After all, that's what is generally used to keep vehicles from going in places they don't belong (1-way streets, exits instead of entrances, etc.). Not 100% effective, but almost always good enough. Let's try signs first. And surface paint. If they work, then no need for any other treatment. Cheaper, safer.
    We don't put telephone poles (with painted yellow diamonds around them) in the middle of streets for good reason. Why is there this insistence on putting obstacles in the middle of trails?
    As an example, for several of these cases, instead of having a no-imagination right angle intersection, why not have a large chamfered approach to the trail with a landscape feature (flowers, whatever) separating the sidewalk and trail into 3 paths arranged in a triangle. Makes it obvious to cyclists that they need to turn, makes it obvious to drivers that they shouldn't run over the flowers, makes things look a little nicer, doesn't require people to process signs, and doesn't require a post in the middle of the trail.

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  11. #18
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    Ribbon cutting ceremony was held Tuesday last week. Here are some photos on Facebook. I see that they didn't paint the bridge.

    Also, I have updated the route in the OP to one that skips Maple AVE altogether, and shaves 30 Seconds, by changing the part to the south of Maple AVE to use Echols ST and East ST instead. Echols ST is bumpy, but is short.

    For those who don't know the area, there is a daily traffic jam for 1.5+ Miles in the afternoon going west, average speed is 7 MPH, and it takes 12 Minutes just to through it. It seems that it ends around Lawyers RD, leading to Reston to the north, or I-66W to the south. If more Vienna residents bike, it would improve the traffic in the area.

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    Quote Originally Posted by n18 View Post
    If more Vienna residents bike, it would improve the traffic in the area.
    I've lived in Vienna for 23 years. Seen it go from a sleepy town to a congested town full of wealthy people inching down Route 123 in their over priced cars. I don't think it's the population of Vienna per se -- I think it's the explosion of the Tysons area. Most of the problem is from people going to and from Tysons to their jobs, but I think they are just passing through. I live off Lawyers road and its a challenge most mornings to turn right with all the traffic coming from Reston. Traffic has gone from bad to worse. Even on the weekends it's terrible. And now they're tearing down a hotel and restaurant on the corner of Nutley and 123 to build some huge mixed use condo development. Its all we need. Same with the Marco Polo lot. And up at the metro. There will be 500 more cars buzzing around in a few years. I can't wait.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pmf View Post
    And now they're tearing down a hotel and restaurant on the corner of Nutley and 123 to build some huge mixed use condo development. Its all we need. Same with the Marco Polo lot. And up at the metro. There will be 500 more cars buzzing around in a few years. I can't wait.
    People have to live somewhere. Better to provide high-density mixed-use development in locations that could be served by high-quality transit than to further expand the car-dependent sprawl somewhere in Chantilly or Loudoun County.

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