Page 30 of 32 FirstFirst ... 202829303132 LastLast
Results 291 to 300 of 319

Thread: Freezing Saddles 2018

  1. #291
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    Arlington
    Posts
    2,060
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AFHokie View Post

    Not to pick on them, but keep in mind people such as Judd, Komorebi, & LSG who I rarely see riding apart from each other will benefit the most from these "social" points.
    Truth - Here's the data from Strava since May of 2016 when I first met Komorebi and LSG. Days are calculated in number of hours, so 1 day = 24 hours of shared riding time, so 500 hours with Komorebi and 158 hours with LSG.

    I'd also add that although, I've ridden with both of them the most out of anybody, I don't consider our rides together as social. We're all quiet people and can ride many miles without saying a word to each other.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Roster.jpeg 
Views:	89 
Size:	32.5 KB 
ID:	15803

  2. Likes wheels&wings, Steve O, Bob James liked this post
  3. #292
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Falls Church
    Posts
    2,245
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Steve O View Post
    no one person has much effect, but the "Crowd" is wiser than even the best experts, and ends up reflecting the optimal outcome.
    This perfectly describes all those posts vilifying Steve O! I guess there's nothing left but to get rid of him altogether...

  4. Likes ShawnoftheDread, Boomer2U, Steve O liked this post
  5. 12-01-2017, 07:05 PM

    I really need to log off the internet and go for a ride.


  6. #293
    Steve O's Avatar
    Steve O is offline I really need to log off the internet and go for a ride.
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Dominion Hills in Arlington VA
    Posts
    3,711
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by lordofthemark View Post
    Right now what the crowd is telling me is that the old FS rules (circa winter 2017) were so great, that FS is oversubscribed, and we are among other things arguing about whom to throw out (losers? non-participants? the unsocial? Instead of just whomever tried to register late) . That suggests that improving it in any way is not actually a priority.
    I don't get that sense at all. There's been a pretty active discussion about revaluing points to make early miles more valuable. Many people have weighed in agreeing that FS is more than just days and miles, and the fact that this discussion is so long is a strong indicator that people are looking for ways to make something good even better.

    We should definitely try a new scoring system this year. Here's why: there is no downside.
    Two possible outcomes:
    • We like the new system better
    • We don't like the new system better

    In each case we'll learn what it is that made it better or not. Even if it's number 2, we will learn what it is that will improve it. It's impossible that the current scoring system is optimal; it's completely arbitrary (as is any system). The only reason for keeping it is the lamest reason (excuse) of all time, "That's the way we've always done it." If we change nothing, then we deny ourselves the opportunity to get better.
    Quote Originally Posted by Judd View Post
    "New Coke was discontinued in July 2002. It remains influential as a cautionary tale against tampering too extensively with a well-established and successful brand."
    New Coke actually teaches us exactly the right lesson. In the process of trying that experiment, they actually learned a lot about their product, their brand, their marketing and their customers. I suspect in the long run it made Coke stronger.

  7. Likes JonRobot liked this post
  8. #294
    Join Date
    Nov 2015
    Location
    Manassas, VA
    Posts
    164
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Should a poll vote (i.e. "the wisdom of the crowd") be taken if the current point system should be changed, and if so, what those changes should be? Or do the designated event leaders (who are very much appreciated) decide? Just from our recent few voices (of the potential 250 participants) in this forum thread, "keep as is" appears more popular (with some willing to go along with a change, but not advocating for a change, which should count as "keep as is").

    I vote no change in official scoring/leader-boards, but as many changes as desired in pointless prizes.

  9. Likes rcannon100 liked this post
  10. #295
    lordofthemark's Avatar
    lordofthemark is offline I really need to log off the internet and go for a ride.
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    The forgotten corner of Alexandria, VA
    Posts
    2,618
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    I am not talking about "stated preference" what people are saying. I am talking about revealed preference. More people want to sign up than we can accommodate. Which indicates that people really like it as it is now. We don't seem to be seeing people leaving - the one person who is leaving expressed a dislike for this kind of change.

    Even from the stated preference POV what is the problem we are trying to solve? Some people join and don't socialize in any particular way? AFAICT that is a problem with excessive recruitment (where are all these people coming from anyway?) see the RCannon quote earlier. Giving points for Strava ridealongs probably won't work, and seems to already have elicited bad feelings. Dropping people who never show up from the competition would work, but seems to make many people even more uncomfortable.

    I will participate and enjoy however FS is scored, as I have said. But it seems to me our problem, if there is any, is excess popularity. Since a sign up fee could create legal issues, the standard economist response to a capacity constraint (which would likely also deter the marginally interested) is unavailable.
    Last edited by lordofthemark; 12-01-2017 at 07:53 PM.

  11. Likes wheels&wings, Bob James, Judd liked this post
  12. #296
    lordofthemark's Avatar
    lordofthemark is offline I really need to log off the internet and go for a ride.
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    The forgotten corner of Alexandria, VA
    Posts
    2,618
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    . Many people have weighed in agreeing that FS is more than just days and miles,

    It is. But not everything that It is needs to be incented through the scoring system. It just emerges naturally as part of a light hearted competition. Incenting something (here I do not speak as an economist) can change the quality of something, especially a social interaction, a concern several have expressed. So unless there is a strong need to, I would suggest not incenting social interaction, beyond the "natural" incentives (we want our team to win - we know to get people riding a group ride to empty calories or adult beverages works, so we organize it) And I am not convinced there is a strong need.

    If there is a need - If FS is less social, I would look not only at scoring, but at what has caused this - is FS too big? Is it more geographically farflung than it was? Are we inviting people who lack the "spirit"?

  13. Likes wheels&wings, Judd liked this post
  14. #297
    Steve O's Avatar
    Steve O is offline I really need to log off the internet and go for a ride.
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Dominion Hills in Arlington VA
    Posts
    3,711
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by hozn View Post
    I think it makes sense to have a "most official" leaderboard.
    Actually, another idea I had (I never run out of ideas) is to have a rotating leaderboard, so each time one logs into FS, a different one is shown. It would raise the interest in some of the other metrics we already track but most people never look at (rainiest, snowiest, coldest, slowest, #kidical, Hinds point, that cool bubble chart, most days team, etc.)

  15. Likes Edelweiss, Bob James, LhasaCM liked this post
  16. #298
    Steve O's Avatar
    Steve O is offline I really need to log off the internet and go for a ride.
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Dominion Hills in Arlington VA
    Posts
    3,711
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Discussion of rules and scoring now has its own thread.

  17. #299
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Arlington, VA
    Posts
    398
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by lordofthemark View Post
    Which indicates that people really like it as it is now. We don't seem to be seeing people leaving -
    .........yet. Not everyone is expressing it on the forum, but I am not alone.

    You fail to account for people who stopped participating last year, partly due to the game's change in direction. And for the dozens of newcomers submitting their one obligatory qualifying post on the forum, who intend to ride their bikes and otherwise prefer to stay anonymous.

    Again, who cares what I think. I've already bailed with no regrets, and you'll get 250 regardless. But the change in dynamics (especially the suggestions that meddle with and complicate scoring) IS causing a change in participation.

    Quote Originally Posted by lordofthemark View Post
    That suggests that improving it in any way is not actually a priority.
    Quote Originally Posted by lordofthemark View Post
    . Many people have weighed in agreeing that FS is more than just days and miles,
    It is. But not everything that It is needs to be incented through the scoring system. It just emerges naturally as part of a light hearted competition.
    Agree with above.
    Last edited by ginacico; 12-02-2017 at 03:32 PM.

  18. Likes streetsmarts, wheels&wings liked this post
  19. #300
    ShawnoftheDread's Avatar
    ShawnoftheDread is offline I really need to log off the internet and go for a ride.
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Annandale-Downtown
    Posts
    3,476
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    I'm against a scoring change for one reason, and it's the best of all possible reasons: Steve O is in favor of it.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  20. ELITE rcannon100 ELITED this post

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •