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Thread: 8/26/16 Cyclist Hit By Car

  1. #21
    Steve O's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DismalScientist View Post
    If the car was astride the crosswalk before the kid entered the crosswalk and the kid T-boned the car, it's primarily the kid's fault. There are no sightlines at that signal. As a driver, you can't see down the sidewalk unless you are already in the crosswalk.
    I do not believe there are any circumstances in which a driver is permitted to block a crosswalk that is in the "walk" phase.

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    Well that means that there never can be right on red if there are insufficient sight-lines at the stop line to execute such a turn.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DismalScientist View Post
    Well that means that there never can be right on red if there are insufficient sight-lines at the stop line to execute such a turn.
    Hear hear! To the end of right-turn-on-red!

    At least in cities and close in suburbs--anywhere there are sidewalks, in my view. Too many pedestrians (and cyclists) are hit or have to dodge out of the way when they have the signal yet drivers don't see them. And I say that as a driver who will surely feel mildly inconvenienced by having to wait a bit longer every now and then.

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  6. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by DismalScientist View Post
    Well that means that there never can be right on red if there are insufficient sight-lines at the stop line to execute such a turn.
    Good. I see that you now understand.

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    Right turn on red means the driver has to yield. If they collide with someone, in the crosswalk or otherwise, they didn't yield the right of way.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DismalScientist View Post
    Well that means that there never can be right on red if there are insufficient sight-lines at the stop line to execute such a turn.
    I would welcome this greatly.

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  12. #27
    mstone is offline I really need to log off the internet and go for a ride.
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    Quote Originally Posted by DismalScientist View Post
    Well that means that there never can be right on red if there are insufficient sight-lines at the stop line to execute such a turn.
    <clutches pearls from the horror of it all>

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    Fine, have the county put up no right turn on red signs at all such intersections. What do you do before this happens?
    What about crosswalks at unsignaled intersections? What if a driver can't see down the sidewalk unless you are in the crosswalk? No right turn there? How about no driving straight in such situations where a cyclist could be on the sidewalk?

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  15. #29
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    I think there is one point we've danced around here: streets are engineered with certain speeds in mind. For example, on two lane roads, where the sightline is inadequate to see cars coming AT THE SPEED LIMIT (ok, maybe prevailing speed) there's a solid yellow. Where the sightline is adequate, there's a dashed yellow. Drivers don't have to think that hard.

    For sidewalks, however, it seems to me like there are not good standards for the speed of sidewalk users. Maybe a better approach would be to base whether right on red is allowed on sightlines for cars stopped at the stopline assuming a 12-mph speed of sidewalk users. (or 8mph? or 10mph?)

    Then it would make sense to tell people riding on sidewalks to keep it under that speed.

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  17. #30
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    I think there is one point we've danced around here: streets are engineered with certain speeds in mind. For example, on two lane roads, where the sightline is inadequate to see cars coming AT THE SPEED LIMIT (ok, maybe prevailing speed) there's a solid yellow. Where the sightline is adequate, there's a dashed yellow. Drivers don't have to think that hard.

    For sidewalks, however, it seems to me like there are not good standards for the speed of sidewalk users. Maybe a better approach would be to base whether right on red is allowed on sightlines for cars stopped at the stopline assuming a 12-mph speed of sidewalk users. (or 8mph? or 10mph?)

    Then it would make sense to tell people riding on sidewalks to keep it under that speed.

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