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View Full Version : Help ID this guy -- caused a bike crash sending 2 to hospital



Kbikeva
08-18-2014, 07:24 AM
From a friend's post.

Yesterday I was testing a Fly6 camera during the Bike Rack group ride. We were close to Military Rd on Beach Dr, when a random cyclist decided to cut in between the line, clipping the front wheel of the person behind me. A cyclist hit and run: he saw the accident, did not bother to stop. Perhaps you may see the rider of that silver/blue Pinarello in your rides: http://youtu.be/eTTGroH8BZI

Rider appears at about :42

If you can ID this person, please contact the Bike Rack (202) 387-2453 so they can pass the info on to the injured.


Let's all be more careful and courteous out there. Jeez.

Kbikeva
08-18-2014, 08:42 AM
The guy was the 'leap frogging' type: does not like to be passed. The group passed him once and he rushed to the head of the group, then started dropping back, followed by this final move. The worst is that as he passed the person leading the group, he quipped something about riders needing better bike handling skills. Someone should have a word with him.

Geoff
08-18-2014, 08:45 AM
From a friend's post.

Yesterday I was testing a Fly6 camera during the Bike Rack group ride. We were close to Military Rd on Beach Dr, when a random cyclist decided to cut in between the line, clipping the front wheel of the person behind me. A cyclist hit and run: he saw the accident, did not bother to stop. Perhaps you may see the rider of that silver/blue Pinarello in your rides: http://youtu.be/eTTGroH8BZI

Rider appears at about :42

If you can ID this person, please contact the Bike Rack (202) 387-2453 so they can pass the info on to the injured.


Let's all be more careful and courteous out there. Jeez.

This incident frustrates and upsets me for a couple reasons. No question the fellow who caused the crash should have stopped. Also, he should have been more cautious when moving to the left. He did signal his move in a way many people do, though the same signal is also used to say "I'm stopping" or "debris / pothole on trail" or even "my hand is going numb."

But I also feel the fellow who took the spill should have been more vigilant and maybe should have dropped back a bit. This is why overlapping wheels are a bad thing. Even granting that the guy who fell is 100% in the right by whatever laws and etiquette rules apply, we all need to be alert because we don't know what the next person will do. Every time I go out I pray that (1) I don't do something dumb that hurts somebody, and (2) if someone else does something dumb, I'll be alert enough to react and avoid.

creadinger
08-18-2014, 08:53 AM
His hand gesture just seemed arrogant to me. I mean I guess people do this type of move in pelotons (none I've ridden in), but I've never known anyone who just HAD to get over right now just so he could pass somebody. If someone puts out a stop sign to me like that I'd be more taken aback and surprised and probably would not immediately drop back either. It's the car version of - "I need to get over because if I don't I can't pass people, you're in my way, and I'm coming over anyway, so watch out. Dick move. He could have waited until the other guy passed.

Sorry, I don't recognize him.

hozn
08-18-2014, 09:48 AM
Yeah, I don't think one can blame the person behind for not dropping back more/faster. It looks like he did slow down when the guy signaled, but hitting the brakes hard in a paceline like that is just as likely to cause an accident for the person behind. The guy moved over way too quickly without ensuring that it was actually clear to do so -- and for no apparent safety reason (e.g. to avoid hitting a person, car, or hole in the road, etc.) What a jackhole. Sorry, I don't recognize him either.

Sunyata
08-18-2014, 10:01 AM
I am just shocked at that video. The guy was too impatient to safely get over which caused other riders to go down and he failed to stop?! WTF?

I really hope this guy can be ID'ed and held liable for the injuries (and bike damage) to those he caused to go down.

:mad:

Powerful Pete
08-18-2014, 10:18 AM
Will keep an eye out for him. These people really annoy me. Poor bike handling skills and not even the decency to stop after causing an accident.:mad:

Geoff
08-18-2014, 10:19 AM
Yeah, I don't think one can blame the person behind for not dropping back more/faster. It looks like he did slow down when the guy signaled, but hitting the brakes hard in a paceline like that is just as likely to cause an accident for the person behind. The guy moved over way too quickly without ensuring that it was actually clear to do so -- and for no apparent safety reason (e.g. to avoid hitting a person, car, or hole in the road, etc.) What a jackhole. Sorry, I don't recognize him either.

No argument with any of that.

dcv
08-18-2014, 11:56 AM
look for him on strava flyby
http://labs.strava.com/flyby/viewer/

dasgeh
08-18-2014, 11:58 AM
Someone did a screen capture and threw it up to the original thread (on Facebook).

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10204581729049100&set=p.10204581729049100&type=1

Dickie
08-19-2014, 07:39 AM
Sorry, I don't recognize him but I will certainly keep my eye out for him. He also has a mirror on his helmet which apparently is solely for vanity reasons... what an asshat!

I hope the two riders are recovering from their injuries.

6451

Steve O
08-19-2014, 10:49 AM
Yeah, I don't think one can blame the person behind for not dropping back more/faster. The guy moved over way too quickly without ensuring that it was actually clear to do so

Making the analogy to driving in traffic, one cannot just put on the turn signal and move left into the next lane. It is always the responsibility of the car making the move (passing, changing lanes, etc.) to make certain it is safe to do so first. Likewise with this cyclist. Since he is making the move, it is his responsibility to make certain it is safe to do so. He did not.

The hit and run, however, is the far more egregious crime. IMO, if found he should be prosecuted just the same as a driver in a hit and run.

OneEighth
08-19-2014, 10:55 AM
Making the analogy to driving in traffic, one cannot just put on the turn signal and move left into the next lane. It is always the responsibility of the car making the move (passing, changing lanes, etc.) to make certain it is safe to do so first. Likewise with this cyclist. Since he is making the move, it is his responsibility to make certain it is safe to do so. He did not.

The hit and run, however, is the far more egregious crime. IMO, if found he should be prosecuted just the same as a driver in a hit and run.

Which gets at my question --- has this been reported to the authorities? It's a hit and run with injuries. On film.

evanstonian
08-19-2014, 05:40 PM
Which gets at my question --- has this been reported to the authorities? It's a hit and run with injuries. On film.

Yes, it was reported to the Park Police (who responded with two patrol cars to the 911 call); one of the officers has the video as well as screen shots from it.

OneEighth
08-19-2014, 06:00 PM
Yes, it was reported to the Park Police (who responded with two patrol cars to the 911 call); one of the officers has the video as well as screen shots from it.

Excellent.
Sure hope someone is able to ID the perp.
More importantly, I hope the injured riders recover fully and quickly.

dkel
08-19-2014, 06:07 PM
I just feel awful about this whole situation. I don't know what else to say. I hope everyone involved can find healing and peace.

Raymo853
08-19-2014, 07:31 PM
That rider is as dumb as a bag of hair and simply without a conscious.

I do miss going on the Bike Rack rides.

Steve O
08-20-2014, 03:46 PM
that rider is as dumb as a bag of hair and simply without a [conscious (sic)] conscience.

ftfy (although there may be some truth to your original - :) )

Raymo853
08-21-2014, 09:22 AM
ftfy (although there may be some truth to your original - :) )

Yes the guy in gray is totally unaware. Or is that grey?

Terpfan
08-21-2014, 10:57 AM
Enter the dangers of riding in weekend pace lines on highly trafficked areas. The guy should have stopped, but alternatively if he's able to leap frog the line and has been doing so then his sudden move really isn't unpredictable and he signaled it. Then again, I'm not a big fan of pace lines because I've had them cut me off several times on the MVT because the leader doesn't want to slow down for a second.

Terpfan
08-21-2014, 10:59 AM
Enter the dangers of riding in weekend pace lines on highly trafficked areas. The guy should have stopped, but alternatively if he's able to leap frog the line and has been doing so then his sudden move really isn't unpredictable and he signaled it. Then again, I'm not a big fan of pace lines because I've had them cut me off several times on the MVT because the leader doesn't want to slow down for a second.

I should add that this guy looks familiar. I've definitely seen him before, but I can't quite place where. Probably on the RCP. It's just he's one of those faces where I'm convinced I've seen it a few times. If I see him, I'll ask his name though.

americancyclo
08-21-2014, 11:24 AM
look for him on strava flyby
http://labs.strava.com/flyby/viewer/

So no one on that ride used strava?

Vicegrip
08-21-2014, 11:27 AM
I just feel awful about this whole situation. I don't know what else to say. I hope everyone involved can find healing and peace.

I feel the same way. I would add that I am glad I am not that guy ether. We humans are a flawed lot and I know I do my fair share of dumb stuff. I would hate to be riding and cause a disaster such as this. Those that know of and take precautions are less likely to cause such events and even less likely to ride away. Assuming he knew the events unfolding behind him.

Just bad news for all. Any word on the riders that went down and how they are doing?

krazygl00
08-21-2014, 12:04 PM
Enter the dangers of riding in weekend pace lines on highly trafficked areas. The guy should have stopped, but alternatively if he's able to leap frog the line and has been doing so then his sudden move really isn't unpredictable and he signaled it. Then again, I'm not a big fan of pace lines because I've had them cut me off several times on the MVT because the leader doesn't want to slow down for a second.

His signal was quick, and was given barely one second before pulling his jackass move. You can see the rider behind him begin to react and allow space, but paceline actions and reactions must be steady and predictable. Also, if I had been the rider behind him it would not have been clear to me exactly what his plan was...to join the paceline...to slowly and cautiously cross it...or to swerve across it like an idiot.

He definitely knew what he had caused. In the video he clearly looks back at the fallen riders. His attitude seems to be, "they didn't yield fast enough; serves them right"

Also, does his front fork look bent to anyone else?

Terpfan
08-21-2014, 03:04 PM
His signal was quick, and was given barely one second before pulling his jackass move. You can see the rider behind him begin to react and allow space, but paceline actions and reactions must be steady and predictable. Also, if I had been the rider behind him it would not have been clear to me exactly what his plan was...to join the paceline...to slowly and cautiously cross it...or to swerve across it like an idiot.

He definitely knew what he had caused. In the video he clearly looks back at the fallen riders. His attitude seems to be, "they didn't yield fast enough; serves them right"

Also, does his front fork look bent to anyone else?

I don't disagree--it was too quick, pacelines should be steady/predictable/and it was a dbag move.

The flip side--trying to run a steady and predictable paceline on a heavily traversed MUP full of walkers/joggers/kids/pets/cyclists/skate boarders/etc of varied experienced levels just strikes me as an invitation for trouble. It may be a wide road, but at least from my experiences on it, seems to be chalk full of every category of people and animal. Shoot, riding home from Thanksgiving I nearly t-boned a deer.

cvcalhoun
08-21-2014, 11:19 PM
His hand gesture just seemed arrogant to me. I mean I guess people do this type of move in pelotons (none I've ridden in), but I've never known anyone who just HAD to get over right now just so he could pass somebody. If someone puts out a stop sign to me like that I'd be more taken aback and surprised and probably would not immediately drop back either. It's the car version of - "I need to get over because if I don't I can't pass people, you're in my way, and I'm coming over anyway, so watch out. Dick move. He could have waited until the other guy passed.

Sorry, I don't recognize him.

What he did was the internationally approved signal for "I'm moving [or turning] left (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hand_signals)." It is the cyclist's (or driver's, if the turn signals are malfunctioning) equivalent of a left turn signal. Thus, I cannot agree that use of the signal on its own is "arrogant." Of course, as with a left turn signal, it does not excuse the person from checking behind him before moving left, and does not permit the person to cut off someone behind him.

consularrider
08-22-2014, 09:43 AM
What he did was the internationally approved signal for "I'm moving [or turning] left (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hand_signals)." It is the cyclist's (or driver's, if the turn signals are malfunctioning) equivalent of a left turn signal. Thus, I cannot agree that use of the signal on its own is "arrogant." Of course, as with a left turn signal, it does not excuse the person from checking behind him before moving left, and does not permit the person to cut off someone behind him.
When I looked at the hand signal, it was closer to being the internationally recognized slowing/stop signal than left turn since was at less than a 45 angle. The only thing in the rider's favor is that he does point his index finger out, for what it is worth

Vicegrip
08-22-2014, 09:56 AM
Giving a signal does not convey any rights to the space or actions to be taken. It means "I want to". Not I have the right to.

rcannon100
08-22-2014, 10:15 AM
/\ /\ /\ THIS /\ /\ /\

(same with calling a pass - it doesnt mean you get to or that people must clear out of your way - pass when it is safe only)

TwoWheelsDC
08-22-2014, 11:14 AM
What he did was the internationally approved signal for "I'm moving [or turning] left (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hand_signals)." It is the cyclist's (or driver's, if the turn signals are malfunctioning) equivalent of a left turn signal. Thus, I cannot agree that use of the signal on its own is "arrogant." Of course, as with a left turn signal, it does not excuse the person from checking behind him before moving left, and does not permit the person to cut off someone behind him.

Well yeah, a widely-accepted signal on its own can't be "arrogant", but the rider certainly displayed a high level of arrogance in giving the signal, since it totally violated etiquette (IMO, at least, he should've waited for the group to pass before making any move) and seemed to be motivated entirely by him not wanting to be passed, rather than a legitimate need to move over.

Terpfan
08-22-2014, 12:42 PM
Giving a signal does not convey any rights to the space or actions to be taken. It means "I want to". Not I have the right to.

Alternatively, it's a sign to me behind you that I better be prepared. I just as well presume that you will move instantaneously to the signal. Then again, I also presume people will move w/o signals given how infrequently they're used.

Raymo853
08-22-2014, 01:50 PM
So no one on that ride used strava?

If you want to try to look, Chuck Harney form the Bike Rack DC did Strava the ride. Not sure if he was in this group as the crash happened.
http://www.strava.com/activities/181584347

americancyclo
08-22-2014, 02:20 PM
I didn't see anything promising on the flyby

cyclingfool
08-22-2014, 02:35 PM
YEah. It was certainly worth checking, but if the perp realized that he caused a crash and that people got hurt, I'm assuming that even if he did Strava, he'd either keep that ride private or not upload it at all to begin with.

Raymo853
08-22-2014, 02:37 PM
I didn't see anything promising on the flyby

Based on the title of this ride and the comments on it, this woman was the second rider that fell. Her activity ends at the Howard ER.

http://www.strava.com/activities/181675762

Raymo853
08-25-2014, 08:13 AM
The video ended up getting used as the basis of an article on Cycling Tips from . I do not agree with the conclusions and suspect the author, and promoted comments, do not know the full story.
http://cyclingtips.com.au/2014/08/why-you-shouldnt-overlap-wheels/

KLizotte
08-25-2014, 01:07 PM
One of the quotes says "As an aside, what surprised me from the twitter post was the number of people who get the terms 'half-wheeling' and 'overlapping' mixed up, when they are two different things entirely."

I'm one of those who would have thought they were the same thing. What is the difference?

Harry Meatmotor
08-25-2014, 01:39 PM
One of the quotes says "As an aside, what surprised me from the twitter post was the number of people who get the terms 'half-wheeling' and 'overlapping' mixed up, when they are two different things entirely."

I'm one of those who would have thought they were the same thing. What is the difference?

Half-wheeling is riding next to another rider, but about half a bike length off his front wheel. It's generally construed as poor etiquette. Wheel overlapping is when you're behind someone and overlap your front wheel with their rear wheel. Overlap is plain dangerous, half-wheeling more or less just annoying.

Tim Kelley
08-25-2014, 01:49 PM
Half-wheeling is riding next to another rider, but about half a bike length off his front wheel. It's generally construed as poor etiquette. Wheel overlapping is when you're behind someone and overlap your front wheel with their rear wheel. Overlap is plain dangerous, half-wheeling more or less just annoying.

Half-wheeling is also a way of demonstrating your dominance over another rider. E.g. "I'm going to halfwheel you all the way up that hill!"

Geoff
08-25-2014, 02:32 PM
Half-wheeling is also a way of demonstrating your dominance over another rider. E.g. "I'm going to halfwheel you all the way up that hill!"

See, that wouldn't work with me because of my ignorance. If someone halfwheels me up a hill, I assume he wants to pass but can't pull it off. If he wants to make me feel bad he should just pass and then accelerate as we reach the top!

Then again, anyone half-wheeling me to assert dominance would feel mighty silly when everyone else on the trail passes the both of us!

Vicegrip
08-26-2014, 06:38 PM
1/2 wheeling to show dominance? What a nice way to muck up a ride.

Tim Kelley
08-27-2014, 08:05 AM
See, that wouldn't work with me because of my ignorance. If someone halfwheels me up a hill, I assume he wants to pass but can't pull it off. If he wants to make me feel bad he should just pass and then accelerate as we reach the top!

Then again, anyone half-wheeling me to assert dominance would feel mighty silly when everyone else on the trail passes the both of us!

No, you wouldn't half-wheel someone random. You'd do it on a spirited group ride, on the road, where you have plenty of space to spread out.

americancyclo
08-27-2014, 08:16 AM
No, you wouldn't half-wheel someone random. You'd do it on a spirited group ride, on the road, where you have plenty of space to spread out.

So you wouldn't half wheel someone up the dark side of Reddish? :p

Tim Kelley
08-27-2014, 08:23 AM
So you wouldn't half wheel someone up the dark side of Reddish? :p

It's all mind games and treachery. Going up Reddish, if you think someone might be stronger than you, one tactic would be to go extra hard to half-wheel them for the first couple minutes while pretending that you're taking it easy, then once they're resigned to the fact that you seem stronger, you can then dictate a slower, more sustainable pace.

Harry Meatmotor
08-27-2014, 09:06 AM
to further elucidate the more ELITE intricacies of half-wheeling, here are some tactical considerations:

if following the lead rider in a group of racers, half-wheeling allows you to stay in the lead rider's blind spot.

by staying in the lead rider's blind spot, you can ATTACK and gain a second or two before the lead rider can respond.

the half-wheeling rider can react to any accelerations by the lead rider without having to go around the lead rider.

the half-wheeling rider can still use a small amount of drafting - particularly if there's a crosswind.

the half-wheeling rider can still see the lead rider's face and will constantly be watching to see if mock agony changes to true agony, especially on climbs. if the half-wheeling rider sees true agony, ATTACK.

sethpo
08-27-2014, 10:10 AM
to further elucidate the more ELITE intricacies of half-wheeling, here are some tactical considerations:

..

the half-wheeling rider can still see the lead rider's face and will constantly be watching to see if mock agony changes to true agony, especially on climbs. if the half-wheeling rider sees true agony, ATTACK.

I do this to car drivers everyday on the busy climb up Bradley Rd into Bethesda. To be honest, I'm sure the tactic works for me.

americancyclo
08-27-2014, 10:38 AM
to further elucidate the more ELITE intricacies of half-wheeling, here are some tactical considerations:

if following the lead rider in a group of racers, half-wheeling allows you to stay in the lead rider's blind spot.

by staying in the lead rider's blind spot, you can ATTACK and gain a second or two before the lead rider can respond.

the half-wheeling rider can react to any accelerations by the lead rider without having to go around the lead rider.

the half-wheeling rider can still use a small amount of drafting - particularly if there's a crosswind.

the half-wheeling rider can still see the lead rider's face and will constantly be watching to see if mock agony changes to true agony, especially on climbs. if the half-wheeling rider sees true agony, ATTACK.

Doesn't half-wheeling dictate that you are in front of the other rider? So you'd have to be the lead rider? Guess I only considered it as two riders and not a larger group.

Vicegrip
08-27-2014, 11:25 AM
to further elucidate the more ELITE intricacies of half-wheeling, here are some tactical considerations:

if following the lead rider in a group of racers, half-wheeling allows you to stay in the lead rider's blind spot.

by staying in the lead rider's blind spot, you can ATTACK and gain a second or two before the lead rider can respond.

the half-wheeling rider can react to any accelerations by the lead rider without having to go around the lead rider.

the half-wheeling rider can still use a small amount of drafting - particularly if there's a crosswind.

the half-wheeling rider can still see the lead rider's face and will constantly be watching to see if mock agony changes to true agony, especially on climbs. if the half-wheeling rider sees true agony, ATTACK.
I hope this is race tactics and not shop ride cat 6. ;)

Harry Meatmotor
08-27-2014, 11:40 AM
I hope this is race tactics and not shop ride cat 6. ;)

Shop ride Cat6 tactics are much less refined, and more like:

if the ... anything ... ATTACK!!!

culimerc
08-27-2014, 12:41 PM
Shop ride Cat6 tactics are much less refined, and more like:

if the ... squirrel! ... ATTACK!!!

There fixed it for you.