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StopMeansStop
07-16-2010, 07:31 AM
I've been ***** at the county for a couple of years about the intersection of Custis trail and N. Oak St (near the Rosslyn Marriott) because cyclists are getting hit by cars or there are near misses. This is happening on a regular basis.

For those of you who don't know the spot, the Custis trail has a nice hill leveling off at this intersection, which also has a stop light. The trail itself has "STOP" painted on the ground in both directions. Bikes coming down the hill can't see cars that have a green light and when the bike blows through the intersection is when you have a problem.

So I wanted to pose this question to you. How would you feel if you ran the stop sign and ran into the car, got injured and then had the driver come after you to pay for the damages to the car?

Mark Blacknell
07-16-2010, 08:05 AM
Well, I'd feel like the person responsible, and pay. So now that I've answered your question, I've got one for you: what's your proposed solution to the situation? Keep in mind that thousands of tickets are issued every day around the country for people rolling through stop signs. And yet people keep doing it.

StopMeansStop
07-16-2010, 11:19 PM
So police issue cyclists tickets for running stop signs?

Mark Blacknell
07-16-2010, 11:26 PM
They do. They did it at Hains Point last week, on the CCT this week, and in Arlington earlier this year, by accounts that I've heard. My question remains.

StopMeansStop
07-17-2010, 07:48 AM
Install chicanes, but the county doesn't want to do it. I think they are being negligent by not doing anything. Too many people are being needlessly injured.

ETA

BTW I bike and drive in that location all the time so I understand both perspectives. In a car I honk my horn just on principle knowing someone is going to blow the sign.

skreaminquadz
07-17-2010, 02:39 PM
I blew a stop sign in Old Town a couple of years ago. It was at 7am on Saturday and NOBODY was around except a cop apparently. Anyhow, he pulled me over and gave me a very harsh reprimand and was about to give me a ticket but decided against it, probably b/c I agreed with him and didn't argue the point. Was I in the wrong, definitely. If I had hit someone it would have been my fault. I struggle to understand how my "guiltiness" could have been questioned considering I blew the Stop sign.

You're right - that is a dangerous intersection which is why they have a Stop sign.

StopMeansStop
07-17-2010, 03:38 PM
So is there a process to get the police to enforce it?

skreaminquadz
07-18-2010, 03:28 PM
Doubt it - but may be worth checking with Arlington County Police.

Also - I do realize you were injured in the process - I'm sorry about that. I do hope you're feeling better and it wasn't too serious.

Hope you're back on the bike soon and happy cycling!!

StopMeansStop
07-20-2010, 07:03 AM
Thankfully I was't involved in any accident at this location.

I however have witnessed several accidents and many many many close shaves.

I'm very ticked off at the County because I have requested that they address this about 3 years ago. How many people have been hurt in that time?

The County wastes so much money with traffic calming because it is the hip "progressive" thing to hate on cars. This intersection is one that needs BICYCLE calming, but they ignore the issue even when people get injured.

Mark Blacknell
07-20-2010, 09:18 AM
I'm very ticked off at the County because I have requested that they address this about 3 years ago. How many people have been hurt in that time?

It's a question of resource allocation, no? Everyone thinks that their corner is the most important. I'd be interested in hearing how many people actually have been hurt at that intersection. My guess is very few.


The County wastes so much money with traffic calming because it is the hip "progressive" thing to hate on cars.
Yeah, now I think you're not really paying attention. Traffic calming comes to neighborhoods because the neighborhoods ask for it. The "hip "progressive"" thing (whatever that is) has nothing to do with it.

Joe Chapline
07-20-2010, 09:50 AM
I just want to throw in a little technicality: If measures need to be taken to change bicyclists' behavior to make this intersection safer, that would still be traffic calming. Bicyclists are part of traffic.

consularrider
07-22-2010, 08:31 AM
You're right - that is a dangerous intersection which is why they have a Stop sign.

It has nothing to do with the intersection being "dangerous." It seems in this area just about all MUP intersections with streets have a stop sign for the MUP users whether or not there is also a traffic light controling the intersection or whether the MUP is parallel to a main road and the cross street has a stop sign and the MUP should have the right of way.

skreaminquadz
07-22-2010, 01:36 PM
It has nothing to do with the intersection being "dangerous."
You're right - any intersection around here has a STOP sign for the MUP. However, what makes this one more dangerous is that you're going downhill (eastbound) with almost no line of site into the parking lot and it isn't a street crossing.

StopMeansStop
07-22-2010, 06:22 PM
Well, this intersection is dangerous because cyclists (and to a lesser extent) pedestrians fail to yield right of way to vehicles when they have a green light and don't realize that drivers know the green cycle is not very long. I can tell you that when pulling out of the garage and I see green I speed up to make the light so I'm not idling for several minutes.

This combined with someone flying downhill and being blind to the traffic until they clear the wall which blocks their sight-line is the problem.

Mark Blacknell
07-22-2010, 06:54 PM
I can tell you that when pulling out of the garage and I see green I speed up to make the light so I'm not idling for several minutes.

So, despite the fact that you've known for years that this is an intersection in which you may encounter pedestrians and cyclists crossing the intersection, you speed up as you approach the intersection?

StopMeansStop
07-22-2010, 08:17 PM
So, despite the fact that you've known for years that this is an intersection in which you may encounter pedestrians and cyclists crossing the intersection, you speed up as you approach the intersection?

Since the driveway I exit is right near the light, I sure do. I'm still within the speed limit. Why should I yield my right-of-way to scofflaws?

I do honk my horn to let them know I'm coming through. Scared the bejeebus out of someone last month but at least they didn't hit me.

Mark Blacknell
07-22-2010, 08:27 PM
Since the driveway I exit is right near the light, I sure do. I'm still within the speed limit. Why should I yield my right-of-way to scofflaws?

Well, I suppose it helps that we now know that your brief convenience is more important to you than the lives of others.

StopMeansStop
07-22-2010, 10:06 PM
Well, I suppose it helps that we now know that your brief convenience is more important to you than the lives of others.
...how does that help? I at least have been trying to get that intersection fixed for several years so people won't get hurt. I guess that makes me a terrible human being.

Joe Chapline
07-23-2010, 06:06 AM
I'm removing the name-calling and closing this thread to comments. Feel free to start new threads if there's something you want to discuss.