PDA

View Full Version : Squeaking, chain, and related



lordofthemark
09-18-2017, 11:06 AM
My chain (I think its the chain) has been very squeaky lately. Most when the cassette is on the smallest ring (highest gear) I finally took the time to lube the chain this weekend, and while that helped, it is still squeaking on the very highest cassette gear, and a little bit on the next highest.

I also used the chain length tool and determined by chain is too stretched and needs to be replaced.

I only lubed the chain itself, and did not apply lube directly to the rings. I also did not check anything else.

Is it likely that the chain stretch is at fault, and I just need to replace the chain? Or is it likely I need to do something else?

Am I doing damage to the cassette now? Can this wait for the weekend (I will not be commuting on Thursday or Friday, because Rosh Hashanah) ? I would prefer to take it to Phoenix, where I hope they would guide me through changing the chain myself. Or I might be able to bring it their Tuesday or Wednesday night.

huskerdont
09-18-2017, 12:10 PM
My chain (I think its the chain) has been very squeaky lately. Most when the cassette is on the smallest ring (highest gear) I finally took the time to lube the chain this weekend, and while that helped, it is still squeaking on the very highest cassette gear, and a little bit on the next highest.

I also used the chain length tool and determined by chain is too stretched and needs to be replaced.

I only lubed the chain itself, and did not apply lube directly to the rings. I also did not check anything else.

Is it likely that the chain stretch is at fault, and I just need to replace the chain? Or is it likely I need to do something else?

Am I doing damage to the cassette now? Can this wait for the weekend (I will not be commuting on Thursday or Friday, because Rosh Hashanah) ? I would prefer to take it to Phoenix, where I hope they would guide me through changing the chain myself. Or I might be able to bring it their Tuesday or Wednesday night.

Squeaking is often the pulleys on the cassette, especially if you lubed the chain and it's still there.

I usually lube the chain but cycle through all cogs and rings; the lube goes from the chain to the cogs and rings. Then I wipe off the excess.

A worn chain does wear the cassette, but a couple of days isn't a big deal.

TwoWheelsDC
09-18-2017, 12:17 PM
Squeaking is often the pulleys on the cassette, especially if you lubed the chain and it's still there.



This. These are actually pretty easy to remove and clean, but spraying (I use spray lube, it's just easier...) or dribbling some lube in the center will generally do the trick.

drevil
09-18-2017, 12:19 PM
Squeaking is often the pulleys on the derailleur...
FTFY

Lube never has to be on the outside surfaces of the chain, cogs, or chainrings. In fact, wet lube will attract more dirt and grit and could make things wear down faster. Lube should be focused on getting on the chain rollers, then like HD said, wipe off as much as possible (by grabbing loosely the chain with a rag and spinning the chain backwards). I usually keep wiping until I hardly see any more oil getting on the rag.

drevil
09-18-2017, 12:23 PM
This. These are actually pretty easy to remove and clean, but spraying (I use spray lube, it's just easier...) or dribbling some lube in the center will generally do the trick.

My problem with spray lube is that it's usually messier to apply than a drip bottle. This could leave to overspray onto rims, and on non-disc rear wheels, lead to failure to stop if the brake pads get contaminated. Don't ask me how I know :D

If spray lube is the only thing available, I'll have a rag behind the chain to try to catch the spray from going all over the place.

TwoWheelsDC
09-18-2017, 12:59 PM
My problem with spray lube is that it's usually messier to apply than a drip bottle. This could leave to overspray onto rims, and on non-disc rear wheels, lead to failure to stop if the brake pads get contaminated. Don't ask me how I know :D

If spray lube is the only thing available, I'll have a rag behind the chain to try to catch the spray from going all over the place.

Yeah, I take special care to not spray any braking surfaces...but spray lube for me is so much faster. And I find spray works well as a cleaning solution for chains and moving parts...when applied liberally, it tends to break up gunk better than any drip lubes I've used.

huskerdont
09-18-2017, 01:22 PM
FTFY

Lube never has to be on the outside surfaces of the chain, cogs, or chainrings. In fact, wet lube will attract more dirt and grit and could make things wear down faster. Lube should be focused on getting on the chain rollers, then like HD said, wipe off as much as possible (by grabbing loosely the chain with a rag and spinning the chain backwards). I usually keep wiping until I hardly see any more oil getting on the rag.

Oops, yeah, that. I was tempted to go back and fix it, but you've got the evidence of my mistake right there. :)

hozn
09-18-2017, 10:12 PM
How "stretched" is the chain? If it's 0.75 or more, I wouldn't change it; the damage is done. (It's true that I don't think it makes economic sense to change chains at all, but will concede that you get maybe 10-15% more life out of a cassette if you change chains around 0.5. At least that is my experience.)

But a stretched chain won't squeak.

Most likely the jockey wheels as others have said. You can drip or spray lube in them.

huskerdont
09-19-2017, 07:28 AM
I'd also add that I've only had temporary luck using lubricant on pulleys/jockey wheels. The squeaking seems to come back fairly quickly. However, I have had good luck removing them, disassembling, and greasing them in the axle area (not sure of the correct term for that area). I'll note that the fine mechanic at Bicycle Space once mentioned to me that he knew of nothing in the literature stating that that was a recommended service, but it has worked very well for me.

drevil
09-19-2017, 07:37 AM
I'd also add that I've only had temporary luck using lubricant on pulleys/jockey wheels. The squeaking seems to come back fairly quickly. However, I have had good luck removing them, disassembling, and greasing them in the axle area (not sure of the correct term for that area). I'll note that the fine mechanic at Bicycle Space once mentioned to me that he knew of nothing in the literature stating that that was a recommended service, but it has worked very well for me.

Related, but not :)
https://imgur.com/a/Laiee

(Not me, btw.)

Vicegrip
09-19-2017, 09:18 AM
How "stretched" is the chain? If it's 0.75 or more, I wouldn't change it; the damage is done. (It's true that I don't think it makes economic sense to change chains at all, but will concede that you get maybe 10-15% more life out of a cassette if you change chains around 0.5. At least that is my experience.)

But a stretched chain won't squeak.

Most likely the jockey wheels as others have said. You can drip or spray lube in them.As said the damage is done. I have had dry chains squeak. Little chirping birds that my riding buddies with undamaged ears could hear. :rolleyes:

I used to run a chain and cassette out together but I have switched to spending the money on more chain swaps. Wait for a smoking deal and buy a bunch of chains on the cheap. They don't go bad, become outdated, out of date or out of style. Stock up deep and change them as needed. I like the feel of a fresh chain that meshes well with good condition chain rings and cogs. Running a chain out past .5 kills the chain rings too and the big ring on my daily ride is not cheap. More chains = smoother overall and more consistent feel long term. Swapping out a chain is a couple of min procedure the second time you do it. Remove old chain, clean up the cog and rings with some degreaser, remove the proper number* of links from the new chain, thread it on, snap the master, wipe the excess lube off and done.
From what I have seen once a chain starts to stretch it is an accelerating event. Destruction of the original bearing surfaces shows up as elongation. Rather than smooth machined surfaces sliding against each other with a film of hydrocarbons between them you have a rough plowed surface. Now the bearing surfaces are grinding rather than slipping. Lube reduces the friction but nothing like it was when new. I notice that a chain stays the same length for a while then starts to elongate at an increasing rate. The time between start of elongation and .75 is less than 1/3 the chain life. Based on this info I now change them out when they first start to elongate more than min measurable. Best feel and least damage to any other $ parts. Change one thing many times or many things less often.

*You know this after writing it down inside the tool box lid the first time you did it. ie, 2 links for Tarmac. 4 for CADD-X.

Steve O
09-19-2017, 02:56 PM
I have had dry chains squeak. Little chirping birds that my riding buddies with undamaged ears could hear. :rolleyes:


Proper chain maintenance is key (http://www.sheldonbrown.com/chainclean.html).

Judd
09-25-2017, 11:02 AM
According to Strava, Lord of the Mark ended up with a new chain and cassette. Any update on the squeaking?

lordofthemark
09-25-2017, 11:11 AM
According to Strava, Lord of the Mark ended up with a new chain and cassette. Any update on the squeaking?

The nice man at Phoenix said the squeaking was coming from the rear derailleur. As part of installing the chain and cassette, he lubed the derailleur and also adjusted the angle to match the new cassette.

The squeaking is gone, and it seemed like the bike shifted and pedaled better than before.

Another really great thing about Phoenix, he did not object to me watching him do all those steps and asking detailed questions, so I feel more likely to try changing the chain and cassette myself the next time I need to do so.